WEBVTT
00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:03.359
Alright everybody, welcome to Cali Cat Tap Talks.
00:00:03.600 --> 00:00:24.160
I got an amazing person here, and his name is Richard Blank, and he's gonna talk about how he left Philly at 27, moved to Costa Rica, built an amazing business with 10,000 employees, I believe, right?
00:00:24.320 --> 00:00:30.000
10,000 employees, and he just followed his dream, so we're gonna listen to that.
00:00:30.320 --> 00:00:56.159
And he's a pinball guy, which is really amazing because here, you know, I'm from California, so in Alameda uh County, there's a pinball museum, and every year they open it up uh for beer heads, and we go and drink beer and we play pinball, which is pretty, pretty cool.
00:00:56.320 --> 00:00:58.479
So let's get right back to Richard.
00:00:58.640 --> 00:01:00.320
Tell us your journey.
00:01:00.719 --> 00:01:04.480
Kalika, I'm so happy to be with you and your audience today.
00:01:04.719 --> 00:01:05.840
This is awesome.
00:01:06.159 --> 00:01:08.079
Love me by the first round.
00:01:08.400 --> 00:01:10.400
But uh, yeah, what a story.
00:01:10.640 --> 00:01:12.319
The long shot from Philadelphia.
00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:20.239
In fact, prior to going live on this podcast, you and I were talking about being the long shot and being authentic and giving back.
00:01:20.400 --> 00:01:22.159
So yeah, I'm one of you.
00:01:22.319 --> 00:01:24.480
You're one of me, I'm one of everybody.
00:01:24.640 --> 00:01:27.359
So I I was just a kid that followed his dream.
00:01:27.439 --> 00:01:29.519
I was a Spanish major in college.
00:01:29.840 --> 00:01:33.280
Postgrad, I worked for an importer of Corona beer.
00:01:33.439 --> 00:01:41.439
So I can talk a little bit about doing promotions and going around the four corner states and uh hanging out with the distributors.
00:01:41.680 --> 00:01:43.599
You know, but it was it was a good run.
00:01:43.760 --> 00:01:50.000
And then at 27, yeah, I came to Costa Rica and decided to stay, fell in love, started a business.
00:01:50.239 --> 00:01:53.519
And uh the only correction is yes, 10,000.
00:01:53.599 --> 00:01:58.480
But those are individuals that passed through my training classes, not all of them stayed.
00:01:58.719 --> 00:02:06.480
Uh throughout the course of two decades, I've trained over 10,000, but my company has grown to you know a solid 150 over the years.
00:02:06.640 --> 00:02:08.879
It's small, but it packs a punch.
00:02:09.280 --> 00:02:19.039
Uh just trying to do it the old school way, Cali Cat, just trying to pay it forward with some good lessons so they can take it with them for the rest of their lives.
00:02:19.919 --> 00:02:27.599
So at the age of 27, did you think that you were going to move over uh to Costa Rica?
00:02:28.159 --> 00:02:30.400
I was built in on momentum, Cali.
00:02:30.879 --> 00:02:33.759
And so sometimes it's like a boxer training.
00:02:33.919 --> 00:02:36.479
They just want to get in the ring and get in the game.
00:02:36.719 --> 00:02:42.400
And so when I had this one in a million opportunity, I had a very good bass Spanish.
00:02:42.639 --> 00:02:45.039
And I had the desire, and 27's a great age.
00:02:45.120 --> 00:02:46.159
I still had my hair.
00:02:46.319 --> 00:02:54.719
And so I came down here and a friend of mine gave me a great job, and I got a chance just to ease into it compared to being thrown into it.
00:02:54.960 --> 00:03:03.039
And so I made a lot of good friends, and you know, when you have good intentions, it's very easy to acclimate and become a part of another community.
00:03:03.199 --> 00:03:12.080
You just show skin, keep an open mind, kind of go with the flow because you're not the big man on campus anymore, you're the new kid.
00:03:12.319 --> 00:03:16.960
And so your senses are just enhanced.
00:03:17.360 --> 00:03:22.240
Besides the translation and the Spanish, every day is something new and something fresh.
00:03:22.319 --> 00:03:29.919
And so, you know, not only are you on your toes, but I believe that your life is much more lucid and and alive.
00:03:30.080 --> 00:03:40.000
And so I was kind of addicted to that rush of being an expatriate and being the one kid that kind of has to make new friends and and build on that personality.
00:03:40.800 --> 00:03:42.159
Wow, wow.
00:03:42.479 --> 00:03:47.759
So you um said you had a hundred and fifty employees, you trained over ten thousand.
00:03:48.080 --> 00:03:54.800
I I'm still like set back from how did you come about with the idea of the call center?
00:03:55.919 --> 00:03:57.199
Great question, Kelly.
00:03:57.599 --> 00:04:02.800
Well, I was only supposed to be here for two months, but I decided to stay.
00:04:02.879 --> 00:04:06.000
And I got past my parents' guilt and other expectations.
00:04:06.240 --> 00:04:11.039
And I stayed at my friend's call center, and I learned the business from the inside out.
00:04:11.520 --> 00:04:13.039
So I got to sit with people.
00:04:13.199 --> 00:04:15.919
You know, it's a ton of testing before buying.
00:04:16.639 --> 00:04:21.360
And so in the course of four years, I went through multiple departments and learned the ins and outs.
00:04:21.439 --> 00:04:33.040
And so when it was time for me to choose a career in my mid-30s, when I had the maturity and the impulse control and some capital, I kind of was going with what I know.
00:04:33.439 --> 00:04:45.600
The only difference is I needed specialists, I needed people that had expertise in IT and the technology, I needed a labor law attorney and a human resources department.
00:04:45.680 --> 00:04:46.399
I couldn't do all that.
00:04:46.879 --> 00:04:49.680
So I needed to bring in team players.
00:04:49.920 --> 00:05:05.439
But as the core of the crew, sharing the soft skills, Cali cat, that you and I have, the sort of empathy that's extended, and the sort of California-Philadelphia mix that when you move abroad, people are just dying to learn it.
00:05:05.680 --> 00:05:12.480
Yeah, we were we were teaching fun classes, kind of like the favorite teacher that you had or the gym coach that motivated you.
00:05:12.639 --> 00:05:20.720
And so I like to incorporate play, which is the pinball and the other arcade machines, with some personality.
00:05:21.199 --> 00:05:25.040
And I'm teaching people where English was their second language.
00:05:25.439 --> 00:05:46.720
So once again, it was enabling me as a native speaker to adjust grammar, make suggestions in regards to diplomatic and strategic vocabulary, and give the people composure to make and receive phone calls and doing at a certain high class level so they have these skills and become extremely marketable.
00:05:47.519 --> 00:05:48.000
Wow.
00:05:48.240 --> 00:05:54.560
So, what made you give back to students?
00:05:54.879 --> 00:06:03.040
Very simply put, I did not have the grades when I graduated the proud Abington High School in '91.
00:06:03.279 --> 00:06:05.839
Um I was an average student.
00:06:06.000 --> 00:06:08.399
I excelled outside the classroom.
00:06:08.800 --> 00:06:12.959
I was a tri-letterman and raised money in different areas and had fun.
00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:14.879
But the grades weren't carrying it.
00:06:14.959 --> 00:06:16.800
I couldn't get into good colleges.
00:06:17.040 --> 00:06:31.680
And so my dedicated Spanish teacher, Dona Esperanza Galchak, and the late principal, Norman Schmidt, they both wrote me recommendation letters, and both of them were enough to get me into the University of Arizona.
00:06:32.000 --> 00:06:41.360
So without them, their support, their leverage, their faith in me to get my act together, it would have never happened.
00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:44.000
And so the circle's complete.
00:06:44.399 --> 00:06:50.879
I now do a second language scholarship for someone graduating Admiral so I can play for their books freshman here.
00:06:51.600 --> 00:07:00.720
But a second language scholarship, I mean, I'm not putting anything away from the arts or athletics or other areas where people can get a scholarship.
00:07:00.879 --> 00:07:02.800
But the second language to me was interesting.
00:07:02.959 --> 00:07:03.279
Why?
00:07:03.439 --> 00:07:04.240
Because I did it.
00:07:04.399 --> 00:07:07.199
You know, people in my family couldn't believe it.
00:07:07.279 --> 00:07:09.680
It was outside the box in the bubble.
00:07:09.920 --> 00:07:17.600
And so anyone that has that dedicated practice and that sort of desire, that is something that you can't spin.
00:07:18.000 --> 00:07:23.839
And when you meet someone from that other culture and they embrace it, and they all they want to do is enhance it.
00:07:24.000 --> 00:07:29.839
Um, it was such a nice um reinforcement that I was getting from the Latino community.
00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:32.240
I kind of knew I was doing something right.
00:07:32.639 --> 00:07:36.480
And um yeah, it was just collecting quarters.
00:07:38.240 --> 00:07:41.759
Kept adding up, you know, enough money to go to the arcade.
00:07:42.319 --> 00:07:55.519
Yeah, I I think it was meant for you to go to Costa Rica and start your spiritual journey over there, um, which is simply amazing.
00:07:55.680 --> 00:07:58.399
Um, so you hired a bassist.
00:07:59.199 --> 00:08:04.879
It's uh Gary Beers to produce a rock song for you.
00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:12.639
For your audience that doesn't know Cali Cat, Gary Gary Beers, the bassist of the legendary Australian band MXS.
00:08:13.519 --> 00:08:22.720
Make a long story short, the first one I ever made down here was Roberto Ruiz, better known as Pygney Faroe, a rocker that goes back to the late 70s.
00:08:22.959 --> 00:08:25.759
Anyway, you'd have been friends for a couple decades.
00:08:26.000 --> 00:08:29.439
And he decided to write a song for my call center called Shine Like the Sun.
00:08:29.759 --> 00:08:33.679
So we produced a local song, played around the country with it.
00:08:34.000 --> 00:08:41.759
Next thing you know, I was listening to a podcast interview of Gary Beers talking about his creates uh custom-made bases out in Los Angeles.
00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:45.440
And so I went on his website, and one section said, Hire Gary.
00:08:45.919 --> 00:08:47.200
I checked it out.
00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:52.799
Callie Cat, he goes, if you got a song, send it to me, and if it makes the cut, I'll work with it on you.
00:08:52.960 --> 00:08:54.879
And he started off at like 600 bucks.
00:08:54.960 --> 00:08:56.159
And so I was like, What?
00:08:56.399 --> 00:08:58.080
I would do that just for an autograph.
00:08:58.159 --> 00:09:02.720
And so I wrote him and I let him know I had a song, and the guy wrote me back, and I couldn't believe it.
00:09:02.879 --> 00:09:04.240
I was so starstruck.
00:09:04.399 --> 00:09:05.360
It was like Santa Claus.
00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:08.720
I was writing him a three-page letter how much I loved in excess.
00:09:09.360 --> 00:09:13.600
And um he liked the song, and it was very interesting.
00:09:13.759 --> 00:09:23.919
He was in Los Angeles, he was able to take out the bass that we sent to him, and he overlapped his version from being conservative to funky, a couple different versions.
00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:30.480
He put in some synthesizers, some percussion, sent it back, and a guy mixed it, and they also did a performance video.
00:09:30.639 --> 00:09:34.399
And um what an experience! Music.
00:09:34.799 --> 00:09:38.000
What a great way to transfer energy between humans.
00:09:38.080 --> 00:09:39.440
It's a gift that keeps on giving.
00:09:39.519 --> 00:09:46.399
I've listened to that song a thousand times, and the fact that uh it was produced uh is amazing.
00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:48.639
But thank you for bringing that up, Cali Cut.
00:09:49.200 --> 00:09:54.879
Yeah, I I I saw it, I was like, man, you you are just an amazing uh journey.
00:09:55.039 --> 00:09:59.120
I mean, didn't you ever want to make an MTV video from the 80s?
00:09:59.200 --> 00:10:03.120
I got arcade games come all convertible, cover like convertible.
00:10:03.200 --> 00:10:05.039
I was like a kid's dream come true.
00:10:05.679 --> 00:10:08.080
And um, you know, you get to play.
00:10:08.240 --> 00:10:12.399
And if you can support the arts in one way or another, that's amazing.
00:10:12.480 --> 00:10:16.080
My thing was I like producing music, so yeah, yeah, I got a chance.
00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:17.279
Wow.
00:10:17.759 --> 00:10:27.120
So being an entrepreneur, was that an easy task, or was that um a hard task for you?
00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:30.240
You could look at it two ways.
00:10:30.639 --> 00:10:40.480
Some people say get the job with the salary and the benefits, but you kind of get tapped out and and there's really not that security.
00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:46.480
In my mid-30s, I kinda wanted to test myself.
00:10:46.720 --> 00:10:49.039
But I wanted to do it in a conservative way.
00:10:49.120 --> 00:10:53.759
I didn't overextend by just renting places and doing things and then going bust.
00:10:54.080 --> 00:11:03.279
I uh I was renting a turnkey station at a blended center, like an internet cafe, so I could build it per seat per month, pay my taxes and make a margin.
00:11:03.360 --> 00:11:07.120
So I could, once again, the the risk and the reward was fantastic.
00:11:07.200 --> 00:11:11.039
I it was just play as you go, kind of like getting a plain seat.
00:11:11.200 --> 00:11:14.720
You're still making money, and uh it just wasn't glamorous.
00:11:14.960 --> 00:11:18.000
And so through like the game of life, you just keep expanding.
00:11:18.159 --> 00:11:25.919
So from there I was able to rent space and get secondhand computers, which was able to offset price, and then I was able to purchase a building and grow from there.
00:11:26.240 --> 00:11:31.120
But I tell you what, if you think you got it, then go for it.
00:11:31.279 --> 00:11:34.320
At least test it and see where you go.
00:11:34.879 --> 00:11:45.120
And I had a lot of naysayers and gray believers out there that were telling me I should be going into different careers, and there's social expectations.
00:11:46.080 --> 00:11:53.600
Come on, Cali Cat, no one writes a blueprint of being a CR of a call center and Spanish, and that's why my stuff is interesting.
00:11:53.679 --> 00:11:57.279
I had a couple zigging zags in there, a couple half moon curves.
00:11:57.759 --> 00:12:00.159
None of this was just a straight line set up for me.
00:12:00.240 --> 00:12:02.000
I I don't know.
00:12:02.159 --> 00:12:08.879
Maybe I wanted to slay a dragon and save a princess and have some sort of life that I was at least content with.
00:12:09.279 --> 00:12:13.200
And um to be an entrepreneur, you gotta be brave.
00:12:13.679 --> 00:12:22.879
And you need to, during those private moments when there's people there not watching it, those are the ones that count the most.
00:12:23.120 --> 00:12:28.080
When you're getting up early, staying up late, sacrificing certain days or events.
00:12:28.399 --> 00:12:34.799
And so those are the ones that know how to grind it, and they have the capacity to do the long game.
00:12:35.039 --> 00:12:37.600
And some people call it the forced march.
00:12:38.080 --> 00:12:41.679
I'm not talking about creating an app and being a millionaire overnight.
00:12:41.759 --> 00:12:42.960
I'm not saying that.
00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:55.919
I'm talking Calicat, you and I go in the full 12 rounds, the full distance, really getting off of that mountain and getting across that desert or surviving on the high seas.
00:12:56.000 --> 00:13:04.399
It's those stories of relentless endurance and faith in oneself where you become crazy in a sense to keep on going.
00:13:04.720 --> 00:13:11.600
But those that do continue that remaining 20%, they're they're the ones that usually can achieve greatness.
00:13:11.840 --> 00:13:14.799
That's the only way I can explain it in that sort of term.
00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:17.279
Wow, wow.
00:13:17.519 --> 00:13:23.519
So, what would you tell a person that wants to pursue a dream?
00:13:23.840 --> 00:13:27.039
At least test things.
00:13:27.759 --> 00:13:29.360
What sort of dream are you looking for?
00:13:29.440 --> 00:13:30.159
It's very broad.
00:13:30.240 --> 00:13:32.080
My my thing was built on momentum.
00:13:32.159 --> 00:13:36.559
The Spanish turned into work, and I take the Spanish where it could work.
00:13:36.720 --> 00:13:39.840
I know naturally I couldn't take my Spanish and go to East Germany.
00:13:40.000 --> 00:13:41.279
I mean, it wouldn't make sense.
00:13:41.440 --> 00:13:52.000
And so um what I was thinking was how could I have a foundation almost like a basket where I can catch?
00:13:52.639 --> 00:14:04.159
And so by practicing certain public speaking skills, writing skills, rhetoric, copious dictation note-taking before AI was even created.
00:14:04.879 --> 00:14:11.279
Learning to be interested compared to being interesting, and and really just engaging.
00:14:12.159 --> 00:14:20.639
And and not for just false flattery, just to, I don't know, just to see if people have any sort of depth and can they tell you a half-decent story.
00:14:20.879 --> 00:14:21.279
Why?
00:14:21.440 --> 00:14:25.919
So maybe ten years from now, someone ever says, Hey, do you know Callie Cat?
00:14:26.080 --> 00:14:28.159
I go, Of course I know Callie Cat.
00:14:28.320 --> 00:14:30.480
What an impression she left on me.
00:14:30.799 --> 00:14:31.759
Super duper.
00:14:32.159 --> 00:14:34.320
And so that's what I'm saying.
00:14:34.399 --> 00:14:42.559
It it could be the fleeting five minutes where you meet someone, but they make such an impression that you remember it for the rest of your life.
00:14:42.799 --> 00:14:53.679
I don't need all of your time, I just need a few minutes, and if we can have a high five and connect and share a smile and a story, then I've passed that flame of the candle, and we now we can move on.
00:14:53.840 --> 00:14:57.919
And so um that's the way I see things, my friend.
00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:05.600
I I don't like pushes and pulls, I like really natural motions and and movement, so it just it it feels right.
00:15:06.080 --> 00:15:06.879
Yeah, yeah.
00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:09.279
I I I totally agree with you.
00:15:09.679 --> 00:15:14.240
And um I wish I just had you earlier in my life.
00:15:16.159 --> 00:15:18.240
Yeah, but then it would have been a lot different.
00:15:18.399 --> 00:15:22.000
You needed to be here at this stage now, you needed those scars.
00:15:23.200 --> 00:15:29.679
I guess hey, but learning from failure.
00:15:29.919 --> 00:15:33.440
What was your learned failure?
00:15:33.600 --> 00:15:36.799
Because some people think when they fail, they just give up.
00:15:37.039 --> 00:15:40.159
I think when you fail, you're learning.
00:15:40.399 --> 00:15:44.320
And you just need to move on and learn from your failure.
00:15:44.480 --> 00:15:45.440
What was yours?
00:15:46.000 --> 00:15:48.799
Kelly Cat, it really depends on the weight.
00:15:49.039 --> 00:15:49.440
Really?
00:15:49.679 --> 00:15:51.679
Was it my own weight?
00:15:52.080 --> 00:15:57.919
Or was the failure due to individuals that had some sort of influence on it?
00:15:58.320 --> 00:16:01.360
And so I try not to carry that weight.
00:16:01.440 --> 00:16:03.519
I'd I'd rather get disappointed than angry.
00:16:03.679 --> 00:16:05.360
Angry's heavy, it's a heavy red.
00:16:05.600 --> 00:16:06.559
I don't like that.
00:16:06.799 --> 00:16:12.480
And so I gotta let it wash over me, go through me, just you gotta put it to bed.
00:16:12.960 --> 00:16:14.639
And so, guess what, kiddo?
00:16:14.720 --> 00:16:20.879
I'm gonna take this big pile that you keep talking about, and I'm gonna break it down into little, little piles.
00:16:21.120 --> 00:16:24.799
So, A, it's manageable, and B, I can cut out 90% of the fat.
00:16:24.879 --> 00:16:32.000
Yeah, I'll take 10%, but the 90% I gotta I gotta put away because it is either outside of my control.
00:16:32.720 --> 00:16:39.919
It was something that someone sabotaged or deliberately did not come through that I depended upon.
00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:43.519
And and so you can't be hard on yourself.
00:16:44.080 --> 00:16:50.000
And when I look at failure, I gotta really scale it from a one to a ten.
00:16:50.240 --> 00:16:56.399
If I'm an idiot and I really did not put gas in my car and I'm in the middle of nowhere, that's on me.
00:16:57.440 --> 00:17:05.200
But uh, you know, there's certain times when someone else is having a bad day and they create a terrible experience at dinner.
00:17:06.000 --> 00:17:09.920
Or there's somebody that's just not considerate of others in public.
00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:14.640
And so, um, what do you do?
00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:16.400
What do you do?
00:17:16.480 --> 00:17:18.640
And so failure to me, mesh.
00:17:18.799 --> 00:17:23.519
The only time it upsets me, my good friend, is if I failed you.
00:17:23.920 --> 00:17:40.720
Because Calicat means more to me than 50 bucks or something else, but I also have to put myself in your shoes and take 99 examples of our friendship into consideration compared to the one time you didn't text back, pick me up on time, forgot something.
00:17:41.039 --> 00:17:43.359
I mean, come on, cut or break.
00:17:44.000 --> 00:17:47.279
And and so I I kind of scale things that way.
00:17:47.440 --> 00:17:52.160
Nothing's really a deal breaker, nothing should be an ultimatum.
00:17:52.559 --> 00:18:00.960
And so, and I treat myself the same way, Cali Cat, because I don't want to carry that weight, to be completely honest with you in regards to failure.
00:18:01.119 --> 00:18:04.640
But if you're talking about business, I've had a thousand failures.
00:18:04.880 --> 00:18:06.480
Oh yeah, I got lucky.
00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:08.799
Just the one home run at the right time.
00:18:09.039 --> 00:18:10.480
But uh, yeah.
00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:12.319
So be it.
00:18:12.480 --> 00:18:21.920
You know, do you just want me to post the greatest times on Facebook or Instagram, or do you want to get raw and just talk about the times I had to get back up after getting knocked down?
00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:25.200
Let's get raw.
00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:27.359
We ended.
00:18:28.559 --> 00:18:28.880
Oh.
00:18:29.839 --> 00:18:34.319
So with with with all that said, and you and you mentioned AI.
00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:37.839
How how will AI affect your business?
00:18:38.160 --> 00:18:45.599
It's definitely gonna gather, and it will not it'll have reduced error, fatigue.
00:18:45.920 --> 00:18:49.759
You can have 24-7 now, you can have a queue that could be a million people long.
00:18:49.920 --> 00:18:51.680
Everyone's gonna get answered.
00:18:52.079 --> 00:19:11.759
My only suggestion is because it will be taking the first and second levels of customer support through omni-channel non-voice, through texting, chat, emails, or as I say, if it's voice, it's integrated voice, where if they get better at it, where you don't have to repeat or enter, they will be able to answer the top 20 questions.
00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:18.400
It's what people like you and I may need from time to time for frustrated.
00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:23.279
If there's a sense of urgency, or depending on the importance, we may press zero.
00:19:23.599 --> 00:19:34.960
And I may want to, if I'm spending this money and this is a valued client relationship, I might want to speak to somebody on the phone to either resolve my issue, let me vent, or just see if there's a better deal.
00:19:35.119 --> 00:19:59.599
And so you will have a higher class concierge department at call centers that will be working with individuals like myself and other generations that prefer certain hand holding and personal contact compared to things that are done just via text or an email, and so um, but that is how it is, I believe, in fair play.
00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:12.799
If somebody has a dollar and they'd rather put it with a kiosk and get their hamburger perfect with extra pickles, better in that business because Joey behind the counter made that mistake.
00:20:13.200 --> 00:20:14.240
What do you want me to say?
00:20:14.319 --> 00:20:17.759
You know, he put in extra onions, and so I kind of get it.
00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:26.400
You know, maybe just the way you guys do it that way is perfect compared to human error, and so I I I might lose that burger, and I and I get it.
00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:42.960
And so um, but the where we do strive is once again that sort of attentive nature, that relationship building rapport, retention, and the just really caring about your client.
00:20:43.599 --> 00:20:51.599
That's the one thing I I think is the saving grace of this industry still, as much as it may have a bad rap and everyone has a bad experience.
00:20:51.839 --> 00:21:03.359
They can also mention the one time that Betty over in Time Life gave them the deal of the century, and they got that football phone and uh had a really nice experience.
00:21:03.440 --> 00:21:07.759
And so, you know, once in a while those are the good players in my industry.
00:21:08.640 --> 00:21:18.079
Well, it is uh customer relationship is number number one, especially when you need to talk to that customer, you know, directly.
00:21:18.240 --> 00:21:19.680
That that does help.